Sprinter doping scandal widens

[Jo-Jo]

I remember Silken Laumann having trouble reading labels on cold medication and cross referencing them with the banned substances list.... or blaming someone else for that.
That incident was very quickly forgotten.

I was thinking about her when this thread got started!

[Jwolf]

I remember Silken Laumann having trouble reading labels on cold medication and cross referencing them with the banned substances list.... or blaming someone else for that.
That incident was very quickly forgotten.

I remember that very clearly! Not forgotten here. And I remember watching the press conference and immediately thinking, "how could she not realize that the cold medicine contained pseudoephedrine?" Then again, I'm often shocked at how many regular people don't read labels of OTC drugs they take, only responding to the drug company's marketing. Many have no idea what drugs they are taking, end up doubling up on the active ingredients, ingesting excess caffeine when they are trying to sleep, or whatever.

Surely elite athletes must be aware of everything that goes into their bodies. "I didn't know" isn't an excuse.

[Dstew]

My only comment is that this is just a common occurrence among all sports that instead of the term "scandal" it should be the "latest doping news".

[turd ferguson]

My SIL was in China earlier this year for a tournament and they were under instructions to eat nothing they didn't bring with them - six days of energy bars and pasta from home - because of the unreliability of the local food supply and the likelihood of steroids in local meat.

I would think that warning would apply to any travelling competitive athlete. I don't see anything wrong with having to bring your own supplements.

Boldon is essentially saying, "Why should we ban these things that are rampant in supplements and everyone is using them?" I disagree. When he talks about "pushing the limits of their supplements" he's talking about finding things that have performance enhancing effects in so-called "natural" preparations.

It's no as if these athletes took the stuff "inadvertently". They knew it was there, knew it was banned, but thought it wouldn't be detected or would be out of their system in time for the test.

Not their own supplements - their own food - to be on the safe side. Basically whatever they could jam into their suitcases which would keep without refrigeration.

As I said upthread - if an athlete gets suspended because they inadvertently ingested something that showed up on a test (I was thinking of the Laumann case but forgot the name) for mere carelessness, I think that's a failure of the system, particularly where there is still rampant intentional doping going on. Its picking the low hanging fruit and sport is no better for it. Its the cops on my street who give people tickets for 5 clicks over where the limit drops because real crime is hard to investigate. Its technically correct but no more.

[Jwolf]

As I said upthread - if an athlete gets suspended because they inadvertently ingested something that showed up on a test (I was thinking of the Laumann case but forgot the name) for mere carelessness, I think that's a failure of the system, particularly where there is still rampant intentional doping going on. Its picking the low hanging fruit and sport is no better for it. Its the cops on my street who give people tickets for 5 clicks over where the limit drops because real crime is hard to investigate. Its technically correct but no more.

But the use of the stimulants by taking various supplements is just as rampant and the supplements are readily available.

The athletes take the supplements for the purposes of recovery and performance, and they know that many of the preparations contain banned stimulants. They can't be allowed to just take whatever supplements are out there and excuse it as "accidental ingestion" if they get caught.

It's a bit different than taking a cold medication which wasn't intended for performance. Silken Laumann (and her team doctor) should have known better-- it was a careless mistake (apprarently the doctor told her to take "Benadryl" not realizing that some Benadryl preparations contain pseudoephdrine-- see my comments above). Pseudoephedrine has been banned for as long as there has been a banned substance list. Still, because the ingestion was deemed inadvertent, she wasn't suspended for it, but she was stripped of her medal.

[La]

And since the supplement industry isn't really regulated, even if the package doesn't list a banned substance, it doesn't mean it's not in there.

[Pat Menzies]

It's a bit different than taking a cold medication which wasn't intended for performance. Silken Laumann (and her team doctor) should have known better-- it was a careless mistake (apprarently the doctor told her to take "Benadryl" not realizing that some Benadryl preparations contain pseudoephdrine-- see my comments above). Pseudoephedrine has been banned for as long as there has been a banned substance list. Still, because the ingestion was deemed inadvertent, she wasn't suspended for it, but she was stripped of her medal.

Apparently pseudoephedrine was removed from the banned list in 2004.
Saying that a cold medication wasn't taken to improve performance is hard to accept when I know a few people who have taken Sudafed and run a best ever time despite being obviously sick.

[Jwolf]

Saying that a cold medication wasn't taken to improve performance is hard to accept when I know a few people who have taken Sudafed and run a best ever time despite being obviously sick.

I know it happens a lot... But I did believe her in this case that it was accidental (although dumb).

I have also know people take it even even when they aren't sick.

[Joe Dwarf]

Love Silken, despite her cold-med reading woes. Bronze medal on a mangled leg, that was awesome!

[Jwolf]

Apparently pseudoephedrine was removed from the banned list in 2004.

Interesting...demoted to "monitored" status, but banned again in 2010.

[dgrant]

Racism plays a huge role in all of this. If Silken Laumann were a black Jamaican sprinter, there's no way she would have had a chance to plead her case in the court of public opinion. She tested positive for a very, very well-known PED (NHLers were going nuts on cold medication for decades before this), but "Whoops, sorry guys" was all it took. If you're Lance Armstrong or Petr Korda your denials are pretty much good enough, and people try to find reasons to forgive and forget. If you're Maurice Greene or Asafa Powell, it's "Yeah right buddy, we've heard it all before..." You're persona non grata before the ink is dry on the newspaper headline.

[turd ferguson]

Racism plays a huge role in all of this. If Silken Laumann were a black Jamaican sprinter, there's no way she would have had a chance to plead her case in the court of public opinion. She tested positive for a very, very well-known PED (NHLers were going nuts on cold medication for decades before this), but "Whoops, sorry guys" was all it took. If you're Lance Armstrong or Petr Korda your denials are pretty much good enough, and people try to find reasons to forgive and forget. If you're Maurice Greene or Asafa Powell, it's "Yeah right buddy, we've heard it all before..." You're persona non grata before the ink is dry on the newspaper headline.

Maybe baseball is finally getting something right - Piazza, Clemens, McGwire are just as persona non grata as Bonds, Sosa and Ramirez

[dgrant]

Racism plays a huge role in all of this. If Silken Laumann were a black Jamaican sprinter, there's no way she would have had a chance to plead her case in the court of public opinion. She tested positive for a very, very well-known PED (NHLers were going nuts on cold medication for decades before this), but "Whoops, sorry guys" was all it took. If you're Lance Armstrong or Petr Korda your denials are pretty much good enough, and people try to find reasons to forgive and forget. If you're Maurice Greene or Asafa Powell, it's "Yeah right buddy, we've heard it all before..." You're persona non grata before the ink is dry on the newspaper headline.

Maybe baseball is finally getting something right - Piazza, Clemens, McGwire are just as persona non grata as Bonds, Sosa and Ramirez

For sure. I was gonna say how do you explain Ryan Braun... but then again how do you explain David Ortiz?

[turd ferguson]

Racism plays a huge role in all of this. If Silken Laumann were a black Jamaican sprinter, there's no way she would have had a chance to plead her case in the court of public opinion. She tested positive for a very, very well-known PED (NHLers were going nuts on cold medication for decades before this), but "Whoops, sorry guys" was all it took. If you're Lance Armstrong or Petr Korda your denials are pretty much good enough, and people try to find reasons to forgive and forget. If you're Maurice Greene or Asafa Powell, it's "Yeah right buddy, we've heard it all before..." You're persona non grata before the ink is dry on the newspaper headline.

Maybe baseball is finally getting something right - Piazza, Clemens, McGwire are just as persona non grata as Bonds, Sosa and Ramirez

For sure. I was gonna say how do you explain Ryan Braun... but then again how do you explain David Ortiz?

Good questions. I was thinking only about the equal rejection of white steroid players by the Hall of Fame, not about current players.

[dgrant]

Racism plays a huge role in all of this. If Silken Laumann were a black Jamaican sprinter, there's no way she would have had a chance to plead her case in the court of public opinion. She tested positive for a very, very well-known PED (NHLers were going nuts on cold medication for decades before this), but "Whoops, sorry guys" was all it took. If you're Lance Armstrong or Petr Korda your denials are pretty much good enough, and people try to find reasons to forgive and forget. If you're Maurice Greene or Asafa Powell, it's "Yeah right buddy, we've heard it all before..." You're persona non grata before the ink is dry on the newspaper headline.

Maybe baseball is finally getting something right - Piazza, Clemens, McGwire are just as persona non grata as Bonds, Sosa and Ramirez

For sure. I was gonna say how do you explain Ryan Braun... but then again how do you explain David Ortiz?

Good questions. I was thinking only about the equal rejection of white steroid players by the Hall of Fame, not about current players.

They let Bert Blyleven in with no Hall of Fame credentials whatsoever, and he's white. So blatant racism...

[turd ferguson]

Racism plays a huge role in all of this. If Silken Laumann were a black Jamaican sprinter, there's no way she would have had a chance to plead her case in the court of public opinion. She tested positive for a very, very well-known PED (NHLers were going nuts on cold medication for decades before this), but "Whoops, sorry guys" was all it took. If you're Lance Armstrong or Petr Korda your denials are pretty much good enough, and people try to find reasons to forgive and forget. If you're Maurice Greene or Asafa Powell, it's "Yeah right buddy, we've heard it all before..." You're persona non grata before the ink is dry on the newspaper headline.

Maybe baseball is finally getting something right - Piazza, Clemens, McGwire are just as persona non grata as Bonds, Sosa and Ramirez

For sure. I was gonna say how do you explain Ryan Braun... but then again how do you explain David Ortiz?

Good questions. I was thinking only about the equal rejection of white steroid players by the Hall of Fame, not about current players.

They let Bert Blyleven in with no Hall of Fame credentials whatsoever, and he's white. So blatant racism...

That was a make-up call for letting Jim Rice in with even worse credentials.

[dgrant]

Racism plays a huge role in all of this. If Silken Laumann were a black Jamaican sprinter, there's no way she would have had a chance to plead her case in the court of public opinion. She tested positive for a very, very well-known PED (NHLers were going nuts on cold medication for decades before this), but "Whoops, sorry guys" was all it took. If you're Lance Armstrong or Petr Korda your denials are pretty much good enough, and people try to find reasons to forgive and forget. If you're Maurice Greene or Asafa Powell, it's "Yeah right buddy, we've heard it all before..." You're persona non grata before the ink is dry on the newspaper headline.

Maybe baseball is finally getting something right - Piazza, Clemens, McGwire are just as persona non grata as Bonds, Sosa and Ramirez

For sure. I was gonna say how do you explain Ryan Braun... but then again how do you explain David Ortiz?

Good questions. I was thinking only about the equal rejection of white steroid players by the Hall of Fame, not about current players.

They let Bert Blyleven in with no Hall of Fame credentials whatsoever, and he's white. So blatant racism...

That was a make-up call for letting Jim Rice in with even worse credentials.

Then I want Dave Stieb in to make up for Barry Larkin.

I've decided to devote my remaining time on this earth to being indignant about Bert Blyleven in the Hall of Fame.

Anyway, what was this thread about again? Gay Jamaicans?

[turd ferguson]

As long as we're at it

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ol ... g/2528283/

Very interesting article - particularly as marijuana and medical marijuana become legal in more places.

the definition of performance enhancing drugs shouldn't be limited to "making you stronger and faster and being able to jump higher. It's how it affects some of the other parameters that are really important like pain or confidence or some of the things that are a bit more difficult to measure or define analytically."

[Jwolf]

That's a good article. This part summarizes the issue well:

Although marijuana isn't viewed to have obvious performance-enhancing qualities, one of the reasons it's on WADA's list in the first place is because of the drug's possible effect during competition. For example, you wouldn't want a bobsledder driving down an icy track while impaired, said Dr. Matt Fedoruk, USADA's science director. He adds that the the definition of performance enhancing drugs shouldn't be limited to "making you stronger and faster and being able to jump higher. It's how it affects some of the other parameters that are really important like pain or confidence or some of the things that are a bit more difficult to measure or define analytically."

I think the higher threshold (meant to identify competition-day use) is a good move.

(Eta: just noticed mike quoted the same part in his edited post.)

[turd ferguson]

That's a good article. This part summarizes the issue well:

Although marijuana isn't viewed to have obvious performance-enhancing qualities, one of the reasons it's on WADA's list in the first place is because of the drug's possible effect during competition. For example, you wouldn't want a bobsledder driving down an icy track while impaired, said Dr. Matt Fedoruk, USADA's science director. He adds that the the definition of performance enhancing drugs shouldn't be limited to "making you stronger and faster and being able to jump higher. It's how it affects some of the other parameters that are really important like pain or confidence or some of the things that are a bit more difficult to measure or define analytically."

I think the higher threshold (meant to identify competition-day use) is a good move.

(Eta: just noticed mike quoted the same part in his edited post.)

I think I was quoting it for a different reason - the view that drug bans aren't just faster/stronger but might extend to pain and confidence. Isn't that an interesting idea - that a drug might be banned because it makes you confident?

[Jwolf]

That's a good article. This part summarizes the issue well:

Although marijuana isn't viewed to have obvious performance-enhancing qualities, one of the reasons it's on WADA's list in the first place is because of the drug's possible effect during competition. For example, you wouldn't want a bobsledder driving down an icy track while impaired, said Dr. Matt Fedoruk, USADA's science director. He adds that the the definition of performance enhancing drugs shouldn't be limited to "making you stronger and faster and being able to jump higher. It's how it affects some of the other parameters that are really important like pain or confidence or some of the things that are a bit more difficult to measure or define analytically."

I think the higher threshold (meant to identify competition-day use) is a good move.

(Eta: just noticed mike quoted the same part in his edited post.)

I think I was quoting it for a different reason - the view that drug bans aren't just faster/stronger but might extend to pain and confidence. Isn't that an interesting idea - that a drug might be banned because it makes you confident?

I think the point is that it doesn't have obvious physiological/physical performance-enhancing effects (like improving your red blood cell count or muscle size), but that the psychological performance enhancing effects are real. Same reason many people cite for banning headphones (where safety issues are often overstated).

I don't have issue with banning pot because its mind-altering.

[turd ferguson]

That's a good article. This part summarizes the issue well:

Although marijuana isn't viewed to have obvious performance-enhancing qualities, one of the reasons it's on WADA's list in the first place is because of the drug's possible effect during competition. For example, you wouldn't want a bobsledder driving down an icy track while impaired, said Dr. Matt Fedoruk, USADA's science director. He adds that the the definition of performance enhancing drugs shouldn't be limited to "making you stronger and faster and being able to jump higher. It's how it affects some of the other parameters that are really important like pain or confidence or some of the things that are a bit more difficult to measure or define analytically."

I think the higher threshold (meant to identify competition-day use) is a good move.

(Eta: just noticed mike quoted the same part in his edited post.)

I think I was quoting it for a different reason - the view that drug bans aren't just faster/stronger but might extend to pain and confidence. Isn't that an interesting idea - that a drug might be banned because it makes you confident?

I think the point is that it doesn't have obvious physiological/physical performance-enhancing effects (like improving your red blood cell count or muscle size), but that the psychological performance enhancing effects are real. Same reason many people cite for banning headphones (where safety issues are often overstated).

I don't have issue with banning pot because its mind-altering.

So?

[Jwolf]

That's a good article. This part summarizes the issue well:

Although marijuana isn't viewed to have obvious performance-enhancing qualities, one of the reasons it's on WADA's list in the first place is because of the drug's possible effect during competition. For example, you wouldn't want a bobsledder driving down an icy track while impaired, said Dr. Matt Fedoruk, USADA's science director. He adds that the the definition of performance enhancing drugs shouldn't be limited to "making you stronger and faster and being able to jump higher. It's how it affects some of the other parameters that are really important like pain or confidence or some of the things that are a bit more difficult to measure or define analytically."

I think the higher threshold (meant to identify competition-day use) is a good move.

(Eta: just noticed mike quoted the same part in his edited post.)

I think I was quoting it for a different reason - the view that drug bans aren't just faster/stronger but might extend to pain and confidence. Isn't that an interesting idea - that a drug might be banned because it makes you confident?

I think the point is that it doesn't have obvious physiological/physical performance-enhancing effects (like improving your red blood cell count or muscle size), but that the psychological performance enhancing effects are real. Same reason many people cite for banning headphones (where safety issues are often overstated).

I don't have issue with banning pot because its mind-altering.

So?

I just said I don't have issue with the ban for that reason- I think it's a good reason.

Get there on your own steam, strength and spirit.

[HCcD]

Hmmm ... wonder if injuries are the real reason ?? Hmmmm ....


http://runningmagazine.ca/sections/news/world-championships-2013/