Running Mania

Very interesting! http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/11/1 ... t_now&_r=0

This statement sums things up pretty well:

What that means in practical terms is that someone who wants to lose weight with exercise” should step on the bathroom scale after a month, Dr. Gaesser said. If at that point your weight remains stubbornly unchanged or has increased, “look closely at your diet and other activities,” he said.

While this study didn’t track the women’s eating and movement habits away from the lab, it is likely that those who gained weight began eating more and moving less when they weren’t on the treadmills, “probably without meaning to,” Dr. Gaesser said.

The study doesn't really explain WHY some people gain weight when exercising-- it only confirms that some people do. The "breakthrough" that they talk about is how the people that you can tell already after 4 weeks whether someone is in that weight gain or no weight gain pattern-- that's why the quote above about stepping on the bathroom scale after a month into an exercise program.

Also the point at the end about regardless of weight gain, all the women at the end were in better shape cardiovascularly, which ultimately is more important for health than weight gain or loss.

Jwolf wrote:Also the point at the end about regardless of weight gain, all the women at the end were in better shape cardiovascularly, which ultimately is more important for health than weight gain or loss.

I agree. There are lots of great reasons to exercise that have nothing to do with weight. Though for people who don't really like exercise, the false promise of weight loss is one thing that often entices them into it.

When I was heavier, exercise did work to help me lose weight. But as I got lighter (and older), I needed to exercise to prevent weight gain.

Jwolf wrote:The study doesn't really explain WHY some people gain weight when exercising-- it only confirms that some people do. The "breakthrough" that they talk about is how the people that you can tell already after 4 weeks whether someone is in that weight gain or no weight gain pattern-- that's why the quote above about stepping on the bathroom scale after a month into an exercise program.

They don't get to the root cause, but at the highest level they do explain that some people respond to exercise with weight loss and some don't. So when someone asks their trainer why they gained weight when they started exercising, the answer [should[/i] be "Because some people don't respond to exercise by losing weight," rather than the usual, "Because you're gaining muscle."

Jwolf wrote:The study doesn't really explain WHY some people gain weight when exercising-- it only confirms that some people do.

While this study didn’t track the women’s eating and movement habits away from the lab, it is likely that those who gained weight began eating more and moving less when they weren’t on the treadmills, “probably without meaning to,” Dr. Gaesser said.

The article talks early on about "calories in, calories out", then doesn't control for or measure half of that equation. Occam's Razor...

turd ferguson wrote:

Jwolf wrote:The study doesn't really explain WHY some people gain weight when exercising-- it only confirms that some people do.

While this study didn’t track the women’s eating and movement habits away from the lab, it is likely that those who gained weight began eating more and moving less when they weren’t on the treadmills, “probably without meaning to,” Dr. Gaesser said.

The article talks early on about "calories in, calories out", then doesn't control for or measure half of that equation. Occam's Razor...

I think the point is that if they did control for calories in, then it would be pretty clear that the women would lose weight. You can't change the laws of physics.

They didn't want the women to intentionally change their behaviour- they just wanted to see what they would do naturally as a result of the increased activity.

La wrote:

Jwolf wrote:The study doesn't really explain WHY some people gain weight when exercising-- it only confirms that some people do. The "breakthrough" that they talk about is how the people that you can tell already after 4 weeks whether someone is in that weight gain or no weight gain pattern-- that's why the quote above about stepping on the bathroom scale after a month into an exercise program.

They don't get to the root cause, but at the highest level they do explain that some people respond to exercise with weight loss and some don't. So when someone asks their trainer why they gained weight when they started exercising, the answer [should[/i] be "Because some people don't respond to exercise by losing weight," rather than the usual, "Because you're gaining muscle."

This is true for sure-- I wish people would just STOP using the "you're gaining muscle" response if someone is only doing cardio exercise-- it's simply not true.

OTOH, I have seen some remarkable-looking body changes when people incorporate weight training into their routine-- their clothes fit differently, they drop inches and sizes, but overall gain weight. In that case they are gaining muscle while losing fat. I need to learn how to do that.

Jwolf wrote:

turd ferguson wrote:

Jwolf wrote:The study doesn't really explain WHY some people gain weight when exercising-- it only confirms that some people do.

While this study didn’t track the women’s eating and movement habits away from the lab, it is likely that those who gained weight began eating more and moving less when they weren’t on the treadmills, “probably without meaning to,” Dr. Gaesser said.

The article talks early on about "calories in, calories out", then doesn't control for or measure half of that equation. Occam's Razor...

I think the point is that if they did control for calories in, then it would be pretty clear that the women would lose weight. You can't change the laws of physics.

They didn't want the women to intentionally change their behaviour- they just wanted to see what they would do naturally as a result of the increased activity.

I meant control in the scientific way. They didn't control or measure the calories in and then acted like what happened was a big mystery that did violate the laws of physics.

I might be criticising the NYT rather than the study - I'm not sure.

turd ferguson wrote:

Jwolf wrote:

turd ferguson wrote:

Jwolf wrote:The study doesn't really explain WHY some people gain weight when exercising-- it only confirms that some people do.

While this study didn’t track the women’s eating and movement habits away from the lab, it is likely that those who gained weight began eating more and moving less when they weren’t on the treadmills, “probably without meaning to,” Dr. Gaesser said.

The article talks early on about "calories in, calories out", then doesn't control for or measure half of that equation. Occam's Razor...

I think the point is that if they did control for calories in, then it would be pretty clear that the women would lose weight. You can't change the laws of physics.

They didn't want the women to intentionally change their behaviour- they just wanted to see what they would do naturally as a result of the increased activity.

I meant control in the scientific way. They didn't control or measure the calories in and then acted like what happened was a big mystery that did violate the laws of physics.

I might be criticising the NYT rather than the study - I'm not sure.

I think you're right (in the last sentence).

While it's almost inevitable that the details in scientific studies are oversimplified when presented by the media, I also think it can be useful to trade some of the scientific rigor (i.e., control or measure every possible influence) in studies like this in favor of looking for more general patterns that can be expressed in terms of everyday behavior. The human body is an extremely complicated machine that does not lend itself to fundamental axioms; even the "calories in versus calories out" maxim has its limits, most recently shown in the findings that artificial sweeteners affect gut bacteria in such a way as to alter digestive efficiency.

Jwolf wrote:

La wrote:

Jwolf wrote:The study doesn't really explain WHY some people gain weight when exercising-- it only confirms that some people do. The "breakthrough" that they talk about is how the people that you can tell already after 4 weeks whether someone is in that weight gain or no weight gain pattern-- that's why the quote above about stepping on the bathroom scale after a month into an exercise program.

They don't get to the root cause, but at the highest level they do explain that some people respond to exercise with weight loss and some don't. So when someone asks their trainer why they gained weight when they started exercising, the answer [should[/i] be "Because some people don't respond to exercise by losing weight," rather than the usual, "Because you're gaining muscle."

This is true for sure-- I wish people would just STOP using the "you're gaining muscle" response if someone is only doing cardio exercise-- it's simply not true.

OTOH, I have seen some remarkable-looking body changes when people incorporate weight training into their routine-- their clothes fit differently, they drop inches and sizes, but overall gain weight. In that case they are gaining muscle while losing fat. I need to learn how to do that.

When I get the formula right, that is cardio and weights, I have gained weight, gone down a pants size and had people tell me I look like I am 160 but in actuality I was 190. But before that happens, I have to go through the Bulgarian Olympic weight lifter phase where I gain weight, my pants to do not fit and people mention that I look bigger. During that stage, I know I am adding muscle and weight but not at the lose fat portion of the program. And if I do not balance that out with the right amount of cardio and intervals, then I just get and look bigger.

This year, come hell or high water, I am following a weight program for 16 weeks - 14 weeks less a day to go. I was around 200 pounds for the October marathon and when I last looked, I am now 209. So the response should be that some people respond quicker, some do not respond and others do gain weight through muscle or it may be too early to say where that person fits in. As Ian noted, the body is a very complex machine that does not easily fall into nice neat sayings.

ian wrote:most recently shown in the findings that artificial sweeteners affect gut bacteria in such a way as to alter digestive efficiency.

I was unaware of that. I guess I'll have to stop drinking Coke Zero and start up on beer.