The Inherent Requirement to Produce Better Results

An environment where you can be open & frank about your quest for speed

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JoaniB
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The Inherent Requirement to Produce Better Results

Postby JoaniB » Sat Mar 17, 2012 1:09 pm

I figured 'the Need for Speed' was just a little too cliché for this chat...

I'm a bit frustrated with my results since I've started running. Admittedly, I'm not the most dedicated Running Room attendee, and between races, I've been known to take longer-than-reasonable breaks. But when I do start a running program with the RR, I generally keep up-to-pace with the standard for the results I want from a half-marathon. The way the RR describes it (in my memory) is that you do the LSD runs at a slower pace, and the shorter runs at a more race-pace speed; this will generally let your body run the race at the time you have practiced for.

However, I find that, once I get to Race Day, I am behind on my race-pace, or I'm having to take more breaks than I want to (using the 10:1 run/walk strategy).

Has anyone experienced this? Is it a matter of practicing? Fitness? Mind over matter? Genetics? And if you have experienced it, how do you break out of it?
Ottawa Race Weekend 10k (2009): 1h07m; Army Half-marathon (2009): 2h38m; St. Patrick's Day 5k (2010): 33m; Ottawa Race Weekend Half-marathon (2010): 2h28m (getting better!); St. Patrick's Day 10k (2011): 1h13m (or not); Calgary 10k (2012): 1h06m (new PB!); Canadian Derby Half-marathon (2012): 2h17m (PB!)
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Ironboy
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Re: The Inherent Requirement to Produce Better Results

Postby Ironboy » Sat Mar 17, 2012 1:17 pm

As I'm sure more eloquent and experienced runner will no doubt reply, you seem to be going about it backwards.

You really shouldn't be choosing a race pace then finding training paces to reach that goal, you should be choosing training paces based on resent performances and seeing what you can manage on race day with that training.

The formula has been around for a long time and has proven results. Longer runs at slower than race pace, medium runs near race pace, shorter/interval runs at faster than race pace.

The most success I've had is plugging in a recent result at a race distance different than my goal race into McMillan running calculator and getting training paces and estimated goal race pace from there, once done, use the actual results to plan the next race, again preferable at a different distance.

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scrumhalfgirl
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Re: The Inherent Requirement to Produce Better Results

Postby scrumhalfgirl » Sat Mar 17, 2012 1:46 pm

+1 to what James said about goal paces - do you have a recent 5 or 10 k result?

Honestly - consistency in running is what is going to see you get the most improvements at this point. Forget about pace and build a base - easy running 4-5 days per week over a period of months, without those long breaks in between races, will help you to get faster. For the half, building up those long runs with consistency so that 15 km or so is an easy distance you can bang out every weekend without fatigue (plus the longer runs in the 18-22km range during your pre-race build up) and then the distance won't be slowing you down.
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Joe Dwarf
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Re: The Inherent Requirement to Produce Better Results

Postby Joe Dwarf » Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:16 pm

Sounds like you are training too fast. As the others have said, you base your training on your actual race results, not your desired race results. Also if you are still doing 10 and 1s during a race, it is probably not necessary for you to do much race pace training, you need to do more easy pace runs and build a better base.

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QuickChick
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Re: The Inherent Requirement to Produce Better Results

Postby QuickChick » Sun Mar 18, 2012 9:06 am

I don't know if you're training too fast, necessarily. I agree that you need to find a more reasonable goal pace for races, and you probably need to do more midweek longer runs if you're burning out in the half.

Throw in a couple runs during the week of at least 10K and you will probably find you're stronger for longer. Also, maybe do a 5K time trial, or even better, train for a 10K race and get a really solid 10K time. Like one where you can't talk at all during the race, and you finish and want to puke because you gave it your all. Then set your goal pace for the half from that. You can probably figure on adding maybe 15 seconds to your 10K pace for a half, and probably 20 or so to your 5K pace. I think the 10K is probably a better predictor.

Once you have a reasonable goal pace, yes- your long runs should be maybe a minute/km slower, your midweek mileage runs will be probably 30 seconds or so slower, and your tempo runs will be at pretty close to your goal pace. Make one of your longer midweek runs a tempo run and that will help. Finally once you've been training for several weeks and have a good groove going, add some long intervals (miles or 2K) at about 5-10K pace to sharpen yourself up.

Good luck!!
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Jwolf
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The Inherent Requirement to Produce Better Results

Postby Jwolf » Sun Mar 18, 2012 10:03 am

I will reiterate what scrum said- If I had to say there was one inherent requirement to improvement it would be consistency.

If you are always going through long periods of no running and then trying to run faster when you start up again, you'll find yourself struggling. Consistency from week to week and year to year will lead to gradual improvement.
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dgrant
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Re: The Inherent Requirement to Produce Better Results

Postby dgrant » Sun Mar 18, 2012 10:29 am

scrumhalfgirl wrote:+1 to what James said about goal paces - do you have a recent 5 or 10 k result?

Honestly - consistency in running is what is going to see you get the most improvements at this point. Forget about pace and build a base - easy running 4-5 days per week over a period of months, without those long breaks in between races, will help you to get faster. For the half, building up those long runs with consistency so that 15 km or so is an easy distance you can bang out every weekend without fatigue (plus the longer runs in the 18-22km range during your pre-race build up) and then the distance won't be slowing you down.


Agree 100%.

I think you'll find your sweet spot when race-oriented training is just fine-tuning (or even an afterthought). That month-after-month habitual fitness is so important.

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jamix
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Re: The Inherent Requirement to Produce Better Results

Postby jamix » Tue Mar 20, 2012 12:00 am

Since no else suggested it, I'll put this out there........Maybe your a non responder :(.

Nonetheless, if your ambitious about running faster times, then the "no breaks" idea is one you really should try to keep as the others have said.

Also maybe do a few 5/10 km races before hand.....Half marathons are looooooong.
2013 GOALS:

- Compete in the "Early Bird Sprint Triathlon" in May
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- Complete an Olympic distance triathlon
- Cycle > 33 km / hr during the cycle portion of a Sprint Triathlon.
- Stay healthy and happy

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April 28th: Manotick 10km (40:16)
May 18th: Ottawa Early Bird Sprint Triathlon (DNF)
June 8th: Riverkeeper SuperSprint (2nd overall)
July 1st: Bushtukah Canada Day 5km (18:37)

Futureisnow
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Re: The Inherent Requirement to Produce Better Results

Postby Futureisnow » Fri May 04, 2012 7:35 am

As far as actual training for the run, I can't add a lot.

But why are you taking longish breaks? Recovery, lack of intrest, weather or to do other things?
It is a good idea to deload during periods during the year, and not train the same extent as when
preparing for a race. Generally 2 good runs a week will maintain your fitness so you're able to
pick up where you left off when you start full bore again. A week or two of R&R can help the body
repair itself if it's not getting the opportunity during the year: little will be lost in a short break.

Are you carrying a much extra weight? 20 pounds can hide on a large frame pretty easily...


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