Jwolf wrote:I just still don't understand how he can be thought of as an inspiration.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtZhG2kWVLY
Tada!
Jwolf wrote:I just still don't understand how he can be thought of as an inspiration.
Jwolf wrote:I just still don't understand how he can be thought of as an inspiration.
drghfx wrote:As much as I think Armstrong is not a very nice human being, if he inspires a person fighting cancer then that is a good thing. However I think organizations walk a fine line when they use an alledged cheat to raise funds for charity.
drghfx wrote:Jwolf wrote:I just still don't understand how he can be thought of as an inspiration.
It's all about celebrity. Justin Beiber throws up on stage and he's an inspiration that he kept on with his concert.
As much as I think Armstrong is not a very nice human being, if he inspires a person fighting cancer then that is a good thing. However I think organizations walk a fine line when they use an alledged cheat to raise funds for charity.
drghfx wrote:Jwolf wrote:I just still don't understand how he can be thought of as an inspiration.
It's all about celebrity. Justin Beiber throws up on stage and he's an inspiration that he kept on with his concert.
As much as I think Armstrong is not a very nice human being, if he inspires a person fighting cancer then that is a good thing. However I think organizations walk a fine line when they use an alledged cheat to raise funds for charity.
Dstew wrote:drghfx wrote:Jwolf wrote:I just still don't understand how he can be thought of as an inspiration.
It's all about celebrity. Justin Beiber throws up on stage and he's an inspiration that he kept on with his concert.
As much as I think Armstrong is not a very nice human being, if he inspires a person fighting cancer then that is a good thing. However I think organizations walk a fine line when they use an alledged cheat to raise funds for charity.
My dad had brain cancer at the same time Ted Kennedy had brain cancer. Kennedy the liberal, my dad the conservative, the politics were irrelevant as there was Ted going for walks, sailing and otherwise providing the illusion at the very least of being able to carry on. Within hours of Ted Kennedy dying of cancer, my dad wrote his own obituary and I could see some of the fight leaving him.
Lance might be a cheat and a lousy human being to boot, but unless one has had cancer or seen someone who has had cancer I do not think one can really appreciate what Lance means. For a person with cancer who sees their entire world collapse around them, Lance is a symbol, a mythical creature who not only survived cancer, he went on to win the Tour de France. So he is a symbol that one does not just have to survive cancer but that they can go onto bigger and better things despite it. Does this excuse his cheating or justify it, of course not. Does it tarnish the symbolism, there is no question it does BUT the essence of the story remains. Everyone was cheating so the cancer guy who was cheating still beat them.
This is the same reason Jake Layton's widow will not tell anyone what type of cancer he died of. I may disagree with her politics but I sent her an email fully supporting her as I saw the other side of the symbol and that is people who have cancer are going to think, I have cancer type "X", Jack had cancer type "X" and would have access to the best medical care in the world and he died so why will I survive.
So like rabid dogs with a bone, continue to rip Lance with blinded rage with regards to what he did on the bike and how he did that for money and ego as he probably desires that but keep in mind the good he did off the bike with regards to the cancer cause no matter how tainted that may be and thus why others do not share your view. I personally reject the caricature of him as pure hero or of pure villain as he shares the same duality we all do as human beings. It is why I do not believe in hero worship. I can admire Lance for whatever his motivation to take the time to fly to Calgary on several occasions to help build a small bike ride to raise funds and awareness into a massive event and at the same time condemn his cheating.
Wu wei wrote:Lance monetized and branded cancer for his personal gain. That is far worse than any doping in sport.
Spirit wrote:5 years ago, when I was reading Lance's book, I was inspired. It was a hero's story of climbing to the top of cycling and also beating cancer.
Now, since I believe about the drugs and perhaps the drugs caused the cancer, his book can't be a truthful story. So, Lance inspired me then; now, I'll choose another inspiration.
Dstew wrote:drghfx wrote:Jwolf wrote:I just still don't understand how he can be thought of as an inspiration.
It's all about celebrity. Justin Beiber throws up on stage and he's an inspiration that he kept on with his concert.
As much as I think Armstrong is not a very nice human being, if he inspires a person fighting cancer then that is a good thing. However I think organizations walk a fine line when they use an alledged cheat to raise funds for charity.
My dad had brain cancer at the same time Ted Kennedy had brain cancer. Kennedy the liberal, my dad the conservative, the politics were irrelevant as there was Ted going for walks, sailing and otherwise providing the illusion at the very least of being able to carry on. Within hours of Ted Kennedy dying of cancer, my dad wrote his own obituary and I could see some of the fight leaving him.
Lance might be a cheat and a lousy human being to boot, but unless one has had cancer or seen someone who has had cancer I do not think one can really appreciate what Lance means. For a person with cancer who sees their entire world collapse around them, Lance is a symbol, a mythical creature who not only survived cancer, he went on to win the Tour de France. So he is a symbol that one does not just have to survive cancer but that they can go onto bigger and better things despite it. Does this excuse his cheating or justify it, of course not. Does it tarnish the symbolism, there is no question it does BUT the essence of the story remains. Everyone was cheating so the cancer guy who was cheating still beat them.
This is the same reason Jake Layton's widow will not tell anyone what type of cancer he died of. I may disagree with her politics but I sent her an email fully supporting her as I saw the other side of the symbol and that is people who have cancer are going to think, I have cancer type "X", Jack had cancer type "X" and would have access to the best medical care in the world and he died so why will I survive.
So like rabid dogs with a bone, continue to rip Lance with blinded rage with regards to what he did on the bike and how he did that for money and ego as he probably desires that but keep in mind the good he did off the bike with regards to the cancer cause no matter how tainted that may be and thus why others do not share your view. I personally reject the caricature of him as pure hero or of pure villain as he shares the same duality we all do as human beings. It is why I do not believe in hero worship. I can admire Lance for whatever his motivation to take the time to fly to Calgary on several occasions to help build a small bike ride to raise funds and awareness into a massive event and at the same time condemn his cheating.
turd ferguson wrote:I agree with you 100%. LA was an inspiration to both my parents going through cancer. He's definitely more of an inspiration than anonymous internet commenters who have spent years ripping LA.
TLDR. Well, skimmed the first few pages. Whether you agree with them or not, I think the tone they take is pretty unprofessional. Sample:RobAllen wrote:The summary of the decision is out.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/109619079/Reasoned-Decision
Warning. It is about 200 pages long.
As a consequence of a number of courageous riders willingness to break the Code of Silence—the “omerta”
Joe Dwarf wrote:TLDR. Well, skimmed the first few pages. Whether you agree with them or not, I think the tone they take is pretty unprofessional. Sample:RobAllen wrote:The summary of the decision is out.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/109619079/Reasoned-Decision
Warning. It is about 200 pages long.As a consequence of a number of courageous riders willingness to break the Code of Silence—the “omerta”
Really, "omerta"?
Page | 140
A.
Armstrong’s Blood Test Results During the 2009 and 2010 Tours de Franceare Consistent with His Continued Use of Blood Doping
USADA collected nine blood samples from Armstrong between February 13, 2009, andApril 30, 2012. The WADA database, ADAMS, contains results from another 29 Armstrong blood samples collected by UCI between October 16, 2008 and January 18, 2011.
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At USADA’s request, these blood test results were examined by Professor Christopher J.Gore, Head of Physiology at the Australian Institute of Sport.
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Prof. Gore observed that acluster of five Armstrong samples during the 2009 Tour de France and his two samples duringthe 2010 Tour de France contained an unusually low percentage of reticulocytes.Reticulocytes are immature red blood cells created naturally by the body. When anathlete adds additional red blood cells to his circulation by transfusing his own stored blood, the body’s production of reticulocytes is suppressed. This is reflected by a decrease in the athlete’sreticulocyte percentage. When Prof. Gore compared the suppressed reticulocyte percentage inArmstrong’s 2009 and 2010 Tour de France samples to the reticulocyte percentage in his other samples, Prof. Gore concluded that the approximate likelihood of Armstrong’s seven suppressedreticulocyte values during the 2009 and 2010 Tours de France occurring naturally was less thanone in a million.
drghfx wrote:Everybody cheated in bike racing. If you didn't cheat, you weren't useful and no team would keep you. The issue I have with Lance is his hipocrisy. When people like Andreu testified under oath and Hamilton and Landis came out and said Armstrong cheated, he threw them under the bus. He called them liars and proven drug cheats. These people were all his friends. He'd sooner his friend Andreu perjure himself than tell the truth about Armstrong's cheating. What type of a friend, or human being for that matter, would do that? That is what separates Armstrong from all of the other cyclists who have been caught cheating or admitted cheating. They didn't protect themselves at the cost of friendships and calling their friends liars and cheats.
turd ferguson wrote:I agree with you 100%. LA was an inspiration to both my parents going through cancer. He's definitely more of an inspiration than anonymous internet commenters who have spent years ripping LA.
Wu wei wrote:Levi Leipheimer:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444799904578048672603746526.html?mod=wsj_share_tweet
People will be disappointed and say I was wrong, that I should have chosen differently, and am just making excuses. I made the decision I made. I don't offer this description of the sport as an excuse, simply as an explanation of the context and reason for my decision. I won't lie about it—I have to own it—I accept responsibility for my decision.
Mr. Landis also made these same statements about Mr. Armstrong’s doping tofederal law enforcement officials during their investigation of criminal activity inconnection with the USPS cycling team. As a consequence, his statements about Mr.Armstrong’s doping carried potential criminal penalties, including potential jail time, if they turned out to be falseMoreover, Mr. Landis’s testimony has been significantly corroborated by the testimonyof many other witnesses. Christian Vande Velde, David Zabriskie, Michael Barry and LeviLeipheimer all testify that long before Floyd Landis tested positive, and while he was stillcompeting in cycling, Landis shared the same accounts about Lance Armstrong’s doping that hehas more recently provided to USADA and to federal law enforcement officials.
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Moreover,Floyd Landis’s description of Lance Armstrong’s doping is highly consistent with the testimonyof other individuals with firsthand knowledge of Mr. Armstrong’s anti-doping rule violationssuch as George Hincapie, Christian Vande Velde, Tyler Hamilton, and Jonathan Vaughters.USADA concludes that these factors combine to make Floyd Landis’s account of Mr.Armstrong’s doping highly credible.
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