Lance steps down from Livestrong, dropped by Nike

[La]

Question: who gets the 7 yellow jerseys now ?

Nobody. Oh and they want their $3M back.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/prudhom ... ut-winners

Christian Prudhomme, the director of the Tour de France, has confirmed that he does not want Lance Armstrong’s seven Tour de France victories reassigned after the UCI ratified the USADA verdict to ban the Texan and disqualify him from results going back to August 1998.

Prudhomme also said that he expects Armstrong to pay back his estimated three million dollars he won in the race.

“There won’t be a winner. The formal decision will be taken by the UCI on Friday but for us, it’s very clear; we want to leave the palmares blank,” Prudhomme told the Reuters news agency after hearing Pat McQuaid speaking during his Geneva press conference.

jono

Wouldn't that be a b*tch, if Armstrong goes back to his ex-teamates to get them to refund their portion of the loot, in particular to those who ratted him out ...

Exactly! Since it's customary for the winner to divide the prize amongst his teammates, rather than keep it for himself.

[HCcD]

Question: who gets the 7 yellow jerseys now ?

Nobody. Oh and they want their $3M back.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/prudhom ... ut-winners

Christian Prudhomme, the director of the Tour de France, has confirmed that he does not want Lance Armstrong’s seven Tour de France victories reassigned after the UCI ratified the USADA verdict to ban the Texan and disqualify him from results going back to August 1998.

Prudhomme also said that he expects Armstrong to pay back his estimated three million dollars he won in the race.

“There won’t be a winner. The formal decision will be taken by the UCI on Friday but for us, it’s very clear; we want to leave the palmares blank,” Prudhomme told the Reuters news agency after hearing Pat McQuaid speaking during his Geneva press conference.

jono

Wouldn't that be a b*tch, if Armstrong goes back to his ex-teamates to get them to refund their portion of the loot, in particular to those who ratted him out ...

Exactly! Since it's customary for the winner to divide the prize amongst his teammates, rather than keep it for himself.

Last week I read that Lance's NET WORTH currently stood at $125 Million US ... wonder how much he will have left after all is said and done with pending lawsuits and claims that may be brought against him ???

[turd ferguson]

Another interesting article.

http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/39875782/

I think the guy is just making excuses for not doing his job as a journalist. Ad revenue should not come into the equation. Saying that he didn't want to take away people's inspiration is a crock too, in my opinion. I think you can easily find many cancer survivor inspirational stories all over the world. Especially now in the age of social media, things can become viral in days.

Yes, he couldn't make unfounded accusations but he could have taken Greg LeMond's calculations to show how improbable it was that any top cyclist was clean. In another thread I posted about how in 1986 the record for climbing one of the Tour de France hills was 48 minutes. 13 years later someone did it over 10 minutes faster and Lance did it only one second slower another time. He could have posted facts like that and let his readers draw their own conclusions. Of course, he probably would have been villified. I remember when Steve Pound came out and said doping in the Olympics was wide spread. He was villifed, but subsequently found out to be correct. Jose Canseco, although not the most likeable fellow, came out about about the wide-spread use of drugs in baseball. He was villified as well by reporters and the average fan, but he was found to be correct as well. People don't like to hear news they don't want to believe, and they don't want to believe things they don't want to be true.

I agree completely.

But also to consider - in 2005 there was lots of speculation and certainly some evidence. But we've set a standard that before we take somebody's medals away, there has to be proof. The gold standard for proof is still a positive test. A mound of unrefuted affidavits is proof. An admission is proof. Even though Dick Pound and Jose Canseco turned out to be right, we don't take medals and records away for speculation and suspicion.

[HCcD]

You asked, what next ??? Well ....

Armstrong to be removed from NYC marathon record books

October 23, 2012
By Michael Doyle

It appears that the name Lance Armstrong will be wiped clean from the New York City Marathon record books.

The disgraced cyclist, who has had his seven Tour de France titles taken away and his name removed from the record books, will be receiving the same treatment from the New York City Road Runners.

In an interview with Bloomberg Businessweek on Tuesday, NYRR head Mary Wittenberg said, “”I anticipate the results will come out of our archives.” And although the marathon major will continue to maintain a relationship with the embattled Livestrong Foundation, Wittenberg did not pull any punches. “Lance doesn’t have a place in running because we will stick to the rules and support USADA,” she said.

USADA’s damning 202 page report highlights systematic cheating on Armstrong’s part. The Texan, who was once hailed as a hero for surviving cancer and then winning a string of Tours, has been dropped by all of his major sponsors after receiving a lifetime ban from cycling.

Armstrong first dabbled in the marathon in 2006, just cracking the 3:00 mark in 2:59:36, with the help of legendary coach Alberto Salazar, as well as a bevy of former athletics heros pacing him through the 42.2K course.

Armstrong then bettered his time the following year by nearly 13 minutes, running a 2:46:43 and placing 214th among male finishers.

“The terms of his arrangement with USADA look like it will apply to say that those times should be erased,” Wittenberg told Businessweek. The New York City Marathon adheres to USADA rules for monitoring PED use. Wittenberg did indicate that the NYRR will wait to see if either Armstrong or WADA choose to appeal the USADA ruling before officially expunging him from their records.

Armstrong also participated in the 2008 Boston Marathon, finishing in the top 500. It is unclear if the B.A.A. will follow suit and remove his name from the 2008 results as well, but the historic race does also abide by USADA regulations.

[CAW]

[DonnaRigs]

[VeloCarrie]

LOL.

[jamix]

At least Armstrong's charity appears to be benefiting from all this at the moment through increased donations!

[Wu wei]

At least Armstrong's charity appears to be benefiting from all this at the moment through increased donations!

That's PR spin.

[HCcD]

Interesting with all the onslaught of articles and information, suddenly coming out of woodwork now ....


Lance Armstrong’s once sterling legacy is unraveling myth by myth, lie by lie

http://aol.sportingnews.com/sport/story/2012-10-23/lance-armstrong-doping-news-tour-de-france-uci-cycling-union-nike-contract

[jamix]

Surprisingly Miguel Indurain believes Lance is innocent.

Contador is also supportive of Lance, though he doesn't really give his opinion on his innocence or guilt.

I'm supportive of Lance too even though admittedly, I now agree with the majority that he did indeed dope

[jamix]

Interesting with all the onslaught of articles and information, suddenly coming out of woodwork now ....


Lance Armstrong’s once sterling legacy is unraveling myth by myth, lie by lie

http://aol.sportingnews.com/sport/story/2012-10-23/lance-armstrong-doping-news-tour-de-france-uci-cycling-union-nike-contract

I read the first one regarding the myth that Lance had superhuman performance. They didn't even address the myth, but instead just talked about some dude who got sick and had to retire from cycling in the early 90's ........I kinda grazed through the other stuff, but the author seems to go off track from what I saw.

[Wu wei]

Surprisingly Miguel Indurain believes Lance is innocent.

Contador is also supportive of Lance, though he doesn't really give his opinion on his innocence or guilt.

I'm supportive of Lance too even though admittedly, I now agree with the majority that he did indeed dope

A bunch of dopers supporting a doper!
Big Mig was a doping genius. I think he was the original pioneer of EPO usage.
How else do you think a guy weighing 75-80kg was winning the Tdf?

And Contador... nuff said.

In their eyes, if you haven't been caught actually sticking the needle in your vein.... your innocent.

[jamix]

Surprisingly Miguel Indurain believes Lance is innocent.

Contador is also supportive of Lance, though he doesn't really give his opinion on his innocence or guilt.

I'm supportive of Lance too even though admittedly, I now agree with the majority that he did indeed dope

A bunch of dopers supporting a doper!
Big Mig was a doping genius. I think he was the original pioneer of EPO usage.
How else do you think a guy weighing 75-80kg was winning the Tdf?

And Contador... nuff said.

In their eyes, if you haven't been caught actually sticking the needle in your vein.... your innocent.

Keep in mind that Contador and Lance don't even like each other.

Regarding Indurain as a doper......Maybe. In addition to never testing positive like Lance, he didn't really get accused much either (whereas Lance did). Maybe he doped just because of the era in which he rode, but there are far less things to point at with him.

[Wu wei]

Keep in mind that Contador and Lance don't even like each other.

Regarding Indurain as a doper......Maybe. In addition to never testing positive like Lance, he didn't really get accused much either (whereas Lance did). Maybe he doped just because of the era in which he rode, but there are far less things to point at with him.

Ok.. for the last time. Lance tested positive, just never sanctioned from a positive test.
So did Miguel... salbutomol in 1994.

How much do you know about Indurain beyond a news article you read about him supporting Lance?

[jamix]

Keep in mind that Contador and Lance don't even like each other.

Regarding Indurain as a doper......Maybe. In addition to never testing positive like Lance, he didn't really get accused much either (whereas Lance did). Maybe he doped just because of the era in which he rode, but there are far less things to point at with him.

Ok.. for the last time. Lance tested positive, just never sanctioned from a positive test.
So did Miguel... salbutomol in 1994.

How much do you know about Indurain beyond a news article you read about him supporting Lance?

I mean positives which weren't overturned soon after.

I read the wiki article on Indurain and some other stuff here and there. He dominated in early 90's so I don't know as much about him. On wiki, it said he "avoided embarrassing questions about doping that other of his generation had to endure".

[Wu wei]

Keep in mind that Contador and Lance don't even like each other.

Regarding Indurain as a doper......Maybe. In addition to never testing positive like Lance, he didn't really get accused much either (whereas Lance did). Maybe he doped just because of the era in which he rode, but there are far less things to point at with him.

Ok.. for the last time. Lance tested positive, just never sanctioned from a positive test.
So did Miguel... salbutomol in 1994.

How much do you know about Indurain beyond a news article you read about him supporting Lance?

I mean positives which weren't overturned soon after.

I read the wiki article on Indurain and some other stuff here and there. He dominated in early 90's so I don't know as much about him. On wiki, it said he "avoided embarrassing questions about doping that other of his generation had to endure".

At the Festina tribunal in 2000 Indurain's teammate Thomas Davy said: "At Banesto there was a system of doping with medical supervision."

[jamix]

At the Festina tribunal in 2000 Indurain's teammate Thomas Davy said: "At Banesto there was a system of doping with medical supervision."

Just imagine the media frenzy if now Indurain confessed

[Dstew]

Lemond:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/others ... uggen.html


The problems with cycling go beyond just Lance despite what some on this board would suggest.

The whole system is corrupt as well as the leadership. Look at Contador - same sort of allegations as Lance from as early as 2007, some drugs tests where he is stripped of the Italy and France titles 2010 and 2011 but then not only is able to cycle in 2012 but wins Spain. If the leadership was really serious about the drug issue then life time bans, pursue not only prize money but have punitive fines, get serious about the testing with true random tests at any time of the day. Given how corrupt the entire sport is, it seems the non-cycling public thinks that Lance is bad but one theme is scape goat even though I personally believe Lance deserves the punishment he has been given. The reason is the perception that other dirty riders seem to get off with relatively minor punishment and are back winning races after their suspensions. The biggest problem seems to be the rewards with still a relatively low risk of getting caught still out weigh the current punishment. As one sports show concluded, may the best chemist win. To fix that perception, cycling is going to have to have some real scapegoats or at least severe punishment to help clean up but the image and the reality. I am still going to watch cycling next year and still be in awe of what they can do regardless of what they do and I suppose the reason there is not rush to do a complete house cleaning. Ban Lance, wipe his name from the record books and hope people forget about the others by next year?

[RobAllen]

Double Post

[RobAllen]

Lemond:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/others ... uggen.html


The problems with cycling go beyond just Lance despite what some on this board would suggest.

The whole system is corrupt as well as the leadership. Look at Contador - same sort of allegations as Lance from as early as 2007, some drugs tests where he is stripped of the Italy and France titles 2010 and 2011 but then not only is able to cycle in 2012 but wins Spain. If the leadership was really serious about the drug issue then life time bans, pursue not only prize money but have punitive fines, get serious about the testing with true random tests at any time of the day. Given how corrupt the entire sport is, it seems the non-cycling public thinks that Lance is bad but one theme is scape goat even though I personally believe Lance deserves the punishment he has been given. The reason is the perception that other dirty riders seem to get off with relatively minor punishment and are back winning races after their suspensions. The biggest problem seems to be the rewards with still a relatively low risk of getting caught still out weigh the current punishment. As one sports show concluded, may the best chemist win. To fix that perception, cycling is going to have to have some real scapegoats or at least severe punishment to help clean up but the image and the reality. I am still going to watch cycling next year and still be in awe of what they can do regardless of what they do and I suppose the reason there is not rush to do a complete house cleaning. Ban Lance, wipe his name from the record books and hope people forget about the others by next year?

The riders are now starting to demand changes in the UCI. This is the ground swell that is required to make changes.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/riders-call-for-uci-to-launch-reforms
Stronger penalties and removal of known dopers from management positions.

Certainly not the clean rider document that Sky instituted, or the firing of Leipheimer fro OPQS. Those actions are backwards.
Lance is the topic because we live in North America and the superhero has been exposed. In Europe the topic is not so much about Lance as it is the state of cycling. There are still big things to come, the Puerto affair still has to go through the court system, the Italian Ferrari investigation and the Bruyneel arbitration. Much more will come out, yes much bigger than Lance. But it won't get the press in North America because Lance is no longer the focus of the other investigations (although he may be brought up a number of times in the Bruyneel case).

[Wu wei]

At the Festina tribunal in 2000 Indurain's teammate Thomas Davy said: "At Banesto there was a system of doping with medical supervision."

Just imagine the media frenzy if now Indurain confessed

Indurain is about as likely to confess as Armstrong... not a chance! Although he's never really denied it in interviews.

I'm not sure it would receive the same sort of attention though. Too long ago.
He's also Spanish. I hate to stereotype.. but the southern European cultures tend to accept a fair amount of cheating as part of the game. Look at all the diving in soccer.
When I raced in Germany, they put our nationality on our bib numbers. Every athlete I saw drafting on the bike was from Italy or Spain... without exception.

[jonovision_man]

True courage: Betsy Anrdeu.

I've read about her but I have never actually seen her speak - she seems quite remarkable. If anyone is looking for a new role model, maybe the one that stood up against cheating/drugs from the start and even gave her husband the gears about it... and paid a huge price.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2012 ... ndreu.html

Of course, she doesn't come with huge PR and legal teams, so it's up to the CBC to get her story out there.

The Lance testifying clips pretty much sum up his character through all of this... in his own words.

jono

[drghfx]

True courage: Betsy Anrdeu.

I've read about her but I have never actually seen her speak - she seems quite remarkable. If anyone is looking for a new role model, maybe the one that stood up against cheating/drugs from the start and even gave her husband the gears about it... and paid a huge price.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2012 ... ndreu.html

Of course, she doesn't come with huge PR and legal teams, so it's up to the CBC to get her story out there.

The Lance testifying clips pretty much sum up his character through all of this... in his own words.

jono

As someone who believe the Andreus and didn't believe Armstrong I also think she was a very courageous woman and one who wouldn't bend from her ethics.

[Pat Menzies]

If it was true courage the Andreu's would have blown the whistle in '96. Instead Frankie got on board the train after Betsy told him that Lance got cancer from the drugs and he (Frankie) had better not go on them or quit if he already was.
After riding the gravy train as long as they could or wanted too, they jumped off and threw everyone onto the tracks. They did that under pressure and with a measure of safety.
Betsy should have showed up at Lance's press conference to announce his comeback and walked up to the podium escorted by Greg Lemond and kicked Lance in the ball if she wanted to show '"true courage".