Coaching?

[trixiee]

Ok... I know I asked this question last year, but...
I'm still rolling things over in my brain.

Why should I consider a coach?
What would having a coach do for me?
I feel uncomfortable "surrendering" my training to a coach
How do I overcome that fear?
How will I know whether or not it's a good use of my hard-earned cash?
How will I convince DH that it's a good use of our hard-earned cash?
I'm cheap.
I'm strong-willed.
I don't trust strangers who try to tell me what to do.
I'm "unmanageable".
I think it may be somewhat of a power-struggle
But, I need a coach. I get injured every year... I don't want to get injured. I want to get stronger and more resilient, and at least keep the same speed.
Some of you know me better than others...
Tell me your thoughts.
I promise I won't hold it against you!

[ultraslacker]

I'm glad you asked this because I had exactly the same thought process this morning!

[MINI-T]

Well, you do describe yourself quite well my friend

Have you talked to Helen about this? I think just seeing her progress over the last year or so would be convincing enough for me.

As for "surrendering" your training, for me it's easy as I find I don't have the discipline required to do things on my own. Being held accountable makes me more conscious of getting my workouts done as I need to report back on them.

I think that by having a good coach, that you are comfortable with and work well with (that is THE number one priority for you IMO) you don't have to worry about feeling unmanageable or dealing with a power struggle. I truly think that the key for you will be the personality mesh. You need someone who will accept that you are going to push back and question things. You aren't the only person who would do that. Personally I really like that some of my PT clients ask "why" when I have them do things, or "what will this do". It shows me that they are interested in what we are doing.

While I'm not necessarily like that with Gabbi, I know that if I do ask her "why" I get an answer that makes sense to me.

[trixiee]

Yah... I push myself pretty hard. I think I need a coach to tell me when to back off...

I need a coach who has coached middle-aged women. I think. (?)

True, Helen has improved...

Can you imagine I'm still thinking Iron Distance Du next year at this time?

(I already have a training plan all done up for myself in a binder...)

[Jo-Jo]

Too many things I want to reply to...so I'm sending you a PM!

[LadyJ]

I loooovvved surrendering my training. I wasn't sure about it at first, but I came to love it. No thinking required!

The only time I complained was when I went 30 days without a complete rest day. Boy oh boy did I grumble that month!

[Iron-North]

Ok... I know I asked this question last year, but...
I'm still rolling things over in my brain.

Why should I consider a coach? Oui!
What would having a coach do for me? They have experience and knowledge
I feel uncomfortable "surrendering" my training to a coach
How do I overcome that fear? Stop thinking too much and just follow his/her plan
How will I know whether or not it's a good use of my hard-earned cash? We only live once. Try it for a while and you might think it's worth the investment
How will I convince DH that it's a good use of our hard-earned cash? Some people take flying lessons, it is way more expensive
I'm cheap. Me too i know what you mean. I would pay a coach now that I know the results and the enjoyment of having someone do all the thinking for my training
I'm strong-willed.
I don't trust strangers who try to tell me what to do. You don't have to all the time
I'm "unmanageable". Nah I don't believe you. you too nice.
I think it may be somewhat of a power-struggle
But, I need a coach. I get injured every year... I don't want to get injured. I want to get stronger and more resilient, and at least keep the same speed.
Some of you know me better than others...
Tell me your thoughts.
I promise I won't hold it against you!

I didn't have a coach but I was following Eric sched . We trained by the book, the book was written by his coach in adaptation to his level, his potential, his feelings, time available for training, checking when he needed to take it easier or push further. A coach with experience has been there and done that. Knowledge about the sports, training of all aspects physical, mental, nutrition, rests.

The coach tell him to do this and he doesn't question it what so ever.

A coach will push you to your limits or hold you so you don't over do it.

With a coach you can just follow the plan and things fall into place.

Yes you should try Trixie! You might really like it!

[Corpus Cani]

Ok... I know I asked this question last year, but...
I'm still rolling things over in my brain.

Why should I consider a coach?
What would having a coach do for me?
I feel uncomfortable "surrendering" my training to a coach
How do I overcome that fear?
How will I know whether or not it's a good use of my hard-earned cash?
How will I convince DH that it's a good use of our hard-earned cash?
I'm cheap.
I'm strong-willed.
I don't trust strangers who try to tell me what to do.
I'm "unmanageable".
I think it may be somewhat of a power-struggle
But, I need a coach. I get injured every year... I don't want to get injured. I want to get stronger and more resilient, and at least keep the same speed.
Some of you know me better than others...
Tell me your thoughts.
I promise I won't hold it against you!

Trix a coach would take into account your age, training history, significant races and times, previous medical history and injuries. A coach would (and this is the important bit) OBSERVE and if available video your training session.
Then the coach would prioritise your needs based on his/her analysis and plan a course of action, firstly focusing on any identifiable faults or problems. TOGETHER you would be involved in the planing and theoretical knowledge of the coach, as this will accelerate your development and motivation in training. In this way communication between you and your coach is much more effective because athletes have a better understanding of why they are being asked to do certain things in training.
You would plan TOGETHER your goals

I’m not too sure how things go as far as fees in Canada
I make a modest living coaching mainly in the college/school system, but as far as the club system goes - a higher level of competition, I coach for nothing provided the runner joins and competes for the club.
Perhaps I should have gone into the personal trainers buisness; then, I'm too old to get a celtic tatoo and wear a gold earing

A lot of the athletic clubs here still retain the word amateur (ie. Vancouver Harriers and Amateur Athletic Club) I know many coaches of Olympic standard working in the club system who don't charge.

Not sure if this applies in Canada.

[jgore]

Unquestioning deference to the decisions of another: does this sound like Trixiee?

Given that you mistook my words of encouragement when going up a hill to be abusive slave-driving, I foresee some difficulties.

Actually, I think it's a very good idea. A coach can be more objective about what you can and should be doing.

[Nick]

You need a deaf coach with a working cattle prod.

[ultraslacker]

You need a deaf coach with a working cattle prod.

me too!

[trixiee]

Nick and Jim. Next time I see you there. will. be. hell. to. pay.




Corpus, that's what I want. Someone to observe my running and biking style. I'm sure I'm doing a lot of things incorrectly. Hence my preponderance to injury. Unfortunately, I live in a small city, and there aren't coaches around here who do that type of thing.
However, I do travel througout the province with my job, and could meet up with a coach in my area on a semi-regular basis.

[QuickChick]

It's definitely good to have someone who can run with you on a semi-regular basis. Pat has an amazing ability to tell from the sound of my breathing how hard I'm pushing and whether I can/should go harder. Either he has really good ears or I'm a weirdly loud breather- maybe both.

I had never considered coaching seriously before this year. I considered it this year because when I run with Pat I run well, and when I followed his informal advice in the spring it worked. Also I have an aggressive marathon goal. Most importantly though, I think a coach, especially someone who knows running well, can see your potential when you may not. That's been the big bonus for me. He went into Sporting Life with me thinking I'd go sub-43. I didn't think I would do that, but I did. He ran Ottawa with me thinking I'd be around 1:37, and well, I wasn't, but he gave me enough feedback about why I'd struggled to make me feel like it was the day/course, and it was do-able another time. At this point, I actually do think I can qualify for Boston, and that's huge. At the start of the summer it was like "well, I'll try, and maybe I'll be able to".

However, the advantage for me was that I found someone I knew who I clicked with running-wise first, and then asked him to help me out. If you can't think of someone right now who does that for you, that's where you'll need to research a bit. Possible things to consider:

-will they make you submit heart rate or garmin data? (this would've been an absolute no-go for me, but others look for that)
-is their motivation style tough-love (doesn't work for me, but works well for others) or more of a supportive style?
- how many other athletes do they have?
- are they working with a prescribed "formula" or do they adapt training to you and your schedule?
- price!

[Jwolf]

For me it comes down to expense. I know I'd benefit from more personalized coaching, but I can't really justify paying right now for it. I am pretty cheap, too, but coaching services generally are not cheap-- Canadian Running had an article about on-line coaching services that range from about 40-120/month. I've thought about it, but can't really do that now. I'd also love to work with one of the local coaches here (John Hill with the Vancouver Falcons Club), but frankly I can't justify the expense of the club/coaching when it's hard for me to get to evening workouts regularly. Perhaps I'll look into that option when I can make the time of the workouts.

I did love working with a coach in the past, but it was a friend who wouldn't charge me (I offered to pay him). Although I didn't run with him often, he knew my running really well and gave me very personalized, high-quality advice. I felt that I got a lot out of it training-wise. I was fortunate and spoiled to have that but now I'm on my own and am attempting to self-coach.

Just a warning, though-- having a coach is not really insurance against getting injured. It is still up to the individual to train smartly, things can still happen seemingly without warning, and the coach can only do so much. Of the people I know that have been coached, I know quite a few that have still gotten injured (if they tend to be injury-prone). It's also not a guarantee that you'll reach your goals (or at least not necessarily any better than if you are self-coached).

[trixiee]

For me it comes down to expense. I know I'd benefit from more personalized coaching, but I can't really justify paying right now for it. I am pretty cheap, too, but coaching services generally are not cheap-- Canadian Running had an article about on-line coaching services that range from about 40-120/month. I've thought about it, but can't really do that now. I'd also love to work with one of the local coaches here (John Hill with the Vancouver Falcons Club), but frankly I can't justify the expense of the club/coaching when it's hard for me to get to evening workouts regularly. Perhaps I'll look into that option when I can make the time of the workouts.

I did love working with a coach in the past, but it was a friend who wouldn't charge me (I offered to pay him). Although I didn't run with him often, he knew my running really well and gave me very personalized, high-quality advice. I felt that I got a lot out of it training-wise. I was fortunate and spoiled to have that but now I'm on my own and am attempting to self-coach.

Just a warning, though-- having a coach is not really insurance against getting injured. It is still up to the individual to train smartly, things can still happen seemingly without warning, and the coach can only do so much. Of the people I know that have been coached, I know quite a few that have still gotten injured (if they tend to be injury-prone). It's also not a guarantee that you'll reach your goals (or at least not necessarily any better than if you are self-coached).

Good points, Jen!

[dgrant]

If injury is the main concern, you're probably looking for two things: an assessment of the cause of the injuries (is it an issue of anatomy/biomechanics/form or more to do with your distances/paces/workouts?) and a plan for moving forward. Ideally these could be performed by the same person, but perhaps not. Depending on the answer to the former, you may or may not need the latter. If it's a biomechanics issue and you get help to solve it, maybe you won't need someone to make an actual schedule or program for you...

[trixiee]

Injury (or the prevention of) is the main concern. I'm pretty self-motivated and confident of my ability to follow and/or adjust a training plan if necessary.

[pheasant plucker]

My 2c:

When I get back to a place where I want to run at the peak of my abilities, I'll hire a coach.

Trying to run to the peak of my abilities without coaching is (for me anyway) a crapshoot. Too many wasted or misguided workouts, too much doing the wrong thing. Anything I get right is by dumb luck or coincidence.

I know coaching costs $$ but the time I spend farting around doing the wrong workout or working out at the wrong intensity is worth something too.

I'm smart enough to know my limitations, and I'm not knowledgeable to design and adapt my own training program. That pretty much sums it up for me.

[LadyV]

Coaching is great, when it is done right.
I have been coached twice for a marathon training.

The first time, I got injured
The second time, I had a "sub-par" (imo) race

In both cases, the coach did not know me, I did not know him. I think it was a mistake on my part.
If I ever decide to be coached again, I will take the time to sorta interview the coaches I am considering to make sure that there is some kind of connection and common views.
Also, I think that a good coach should be demanding regular feedback (ie: at least wekly) - if he / she is not interested to know how you are doing, something's amiss (maybe too busy with other runners, etc)
I think that taking the time to shop around and pick the right coach is very important (after all, it does cost quite a bit of $$$)

[Jwolf]

Injury (or the prevention of) is the main concern. I'm pretty self-motivated and confident of my ability to follow and/or adjust a training plan if necessary.

If injury prevention is the main concern, I'm not sure that a coach is really the answer. I'd like to say that finding a personal trainer with a running specialty might be the answer, but I'd also be reluctant to pay someone for that unless I really knew they had more knowledge than I do. Injuries tend to be a trial and error thing-- figure out what works for you and go for it, and no one knows what your body feels like other than you.

[fe.sweetpea]

If injury is the main concern, you're probably looking for two things: an assessment of the cause of the injuries (is it an issue of anatomy/biomechanics/form or more to do with your distances/paces/workouts?) and a plan for moving forward. Ideally these could be performed by the same person, but perhaps not. Depending on the answer to the former, you may or may not need the latter. If it's a biomechanics issue and you get help to solve it, maybe you won't need someone to make an actual schedule or program for you...

I think finding someone to do both is highly unlikely. If the person offering sound advice about biomechanics and injury prevention is good chances are they are in another field (pedorthist, chiropractor, physiotherapist etc) with a good clientele and coaching is not something the are likely to offer (I can think of a few, but not many that offer both soundly).

But, the right coach should for sure be able to tell you where to get sound advice about injury prevention that isn't related to training load.

Also, I will add to the discussion, if/when you are ready to hire someone, don't wait until you are close to wanting to start training for a big race to hire someone. If you do and you don't like the person it is going to be difficult to shift. I worked with my coach for two years at shorter racing before training for a half IM or an IM. I'm REALLY glad that I was able to honestly ask him first if he felt I was ready and when we determined that I was I was happy that he already knew a lot about me and my training going in.

[DougG]

Trix, when I read your initial post, I thought you answered your own questions. You appear to be trying to talk yourself into getting a coach.

I'm "unmanageable".

You? I doubt that, you are way too nice.

[trixiee]

Trix, when I read your initial post, I thought you answered your own questions. You appear to be trying to talk yourself into getting a coach.

I'm "unmanageable".

You? I doubt that, you are way too nice.

But, I'm not really sure it's what I want... as was posted earlier, what I really want/need I think, is a gait analysis, and a biomechanical issue analysis, with a trainer that can help me correct those... I think.

By saying unmanageable, I mean I ask a lot of questions! Some people think I may be questioning their abilities, but I just need to know why I'm doing things...

I'm coming to Ottawa for a 4 hour meeting... I have the whole morning free... I wonder if the Ottawa peeps can put me in touch with someone there?

[DougG]

I would think asking a lot of questions is a good thing. Better that then just accepting what is being said.

[scrumhalfgirl]

Trix, when I read your initial post, I thought you answered your own questions. You appear to be trying to talk yourself into getting a coach.

I'm "unmanageable".

You? I doubt that, you are way too nice.

But, I'm not really sure it's what I want... as was posted earlier, what I really want/need I think, is a gait analysis, and a biomechanical issue analysis, with a trainer that can help me correct those... I think.

By saying unmanageable, I mean I ask a lot of questions! Some people think I may be questioning their abilities, but I just need to know why I'm doing things...

I'm coming to Ottawa for a 4 hour meeting... I have the whole morning free... I wonder if the Ottawa peeps can put me in touch with someone there?

Have you looked into the running assessment that they do here at PSI? I believe the woman is trained as a physio. I know there are people on the board who used her - the striders, I think, and perhaps also Brian and Heather? It *may* require two visits though, but I've heard really good things and she seems to do exactly what you're looking for.