Question about Ultra Training for a 50k

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mlazenby
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Postby mlazenby » Wed May 24, 2006 11:38 am

jgore wrote:my Monday nooner with the Speedy Ladies


This sounds like something I could use.
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Postby Size5 » Wed May 24, 2006 11:42 am

mlazenby wrote:
jgore wrote:my Monday nooner with the Speedy Ladies


This sounds like something I could use.
:lol: :lol:

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Postby Size5 » Wed May 24, 2006 11:44 am

jgore wrote:To be honest, I've not really thought about why it interests me. I'm not as goal-oriented as I perceive Robbie to be. Perhaps some introspection is in order. Mind you, butter tarts is as good a reason as any. :D


I don't think this is absoultely necessary to do.... I just think it helps to have some clarity as to WHY. I dont' think it needs to e some big goal orriented reason either.... One of the bigger reasons I feel is to learn about myself and to find ways to use my own inner resources when they are needed. That isn't exactly some goal orriented reason....

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Postby Doonst » Wed May 24, 2006 11:46 am

jgore wrote:Good luck this weekend, Mike.


Mike & Krista, thanks for the responses. It didn't occur to me that I was almost doing b2b long ones anyway until Krista mentioned a long run followed by 10K; I already do that as my Monday nooner with the Speedy Ladies is usually about 10K. I was thinking of 2 long runs on the weekend, but the Monday run hadn't even registered. The funny thing is that my legs feel better on Monday if I've done the long run on Sunday than if I did it on Saturday. Strange, eh?

To be honest, I've not really thought about why it interests me. I'm not as goal-oriented as I perceive Robbie to be. Perhaps some introspection is in order. Mind you, butter tarts is as good a reason as any. :D

Sorry for the hijack, Robbie. :oops:


Mike says that there is race-day registration at Sulphur Springs this Saturday; why not pop down and do 25 just to see if it does anything for you. No big investment, there will be a bunch of us there. Maybe you could carpool with Jane and Heather.

Lots of time to get back for Monday noon. :roll:
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Postby jgore » Wed May 24, 2006 6:21 pm

Thanks for the idea, Sheldon, but I really have to talk myself into this. Also, I'm saving up time for the beginning of July; my sister and her kids are headed this way.

I think I will try the b2b this weekend, though.

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Postby Size5 » Wed May 24, 2006 8:41 pm

jgore wrote:I think I will try the b2b this weekend, though.


8) Let us know how it goes.... Some of us will be skipping B2B runs this weekend in favor of the "all in one shot distance" types of runs :lol:

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Postby RonPerth » Wed May 24, 2006 9:21 pm

Hey Robbie, I did my first 50k a couple of weeks ago in Toronto. My basic plan was to gradually build up my time on my feet to over 4 hours. That was with the idea in mind that the 50 would take me over 5 hours. That was about how it worked out, and it worked out fine.
Now life being as it is, there were weekends when I couldn't find the time for that long run, so I did a b-t-b, Saturday with my running buddies, and Sunday another couple of hours alone. I like that idea, and it works out fine too to alternate with the long runs for mental freshness.
One of my running friends is a real ultra runner, holds a couple of Can. records in the 24 hr. range, I believe, and she is a believer in the back to back, condition yourself mentally and physically to run when you're tired approach. But her long weekends in training peak would be in the neighborhood of 20 and 50k; she doesn't kill herself.
Try out the course during the summer if you can. I got a wake-up call at Haliburton last year. I had just finished my first marathon and felt confident. I was thinking of entering the Haliburton 50k. But I went up there to try out the trails, and it took me 3 1/2 hours to do about 25k, and almost killed me. 50k would have been really impossible; would have been 8 hours maybe; way over my head at the time. Now this year...............?

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Postby dwayne_runs_far » Wed May 24, 2006 9:32 pm

I think it's really cool how these ultra thoughts are coming out of the woodwork :-)

This has been the most intense physical and mental training I've undertaken, and I'm really looking forward to putting it all to the test this weekend. I hope you guys get to have this experience too.

As Krista mentioned, there is a different vibe to the ultra scene; and I've only experienced it via a few individuals outside of an event.

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Postby dgrant1 » Wed May 24, 2006 10:27 pm

Doonst wrote: Mike says that there is race-day registration at Sulphur Springs this Saturday; why not pop down and do 25 just to see if it does anything for you.


Hmmm.

8)

Now that's a thought...

Sheldon, if I do this, will you do the Bread and Honey??? 8) :wink:
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Postby Doonst » Wed May 24, 2006 10:49 pm

dgrant1 wrote:
Doonst wrote: Mike says that there is race-day registration at Sulphur Springs this Saturday; why not pop down and do 25 just to see if it does anything for you.


Hmmm.

8)

Now that's a thought...

Sheldon, if I do this, will you do the Bread and Honey??? 8) :wink:


I'll see your 25, and raise you 15.
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So all you sinners come out
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Postby dgrant1 » Thu May 25, 2006 7:39 am

Doonst wrote: I'll see your 25, and raise you 15.

Yer on! See ya there... :wink:
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Postby Size5 » Thu May 25, 2006 8:08 am

dgrant1 wrote:
Doonst wrote: I'll see your 25, and raise you 15.

Yer on! See ya there... :wink:


People flocking from all over to run trail races :D

Jim I'm telling you, this is where it is at :D Granted I realize SS is a no this year......

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Postby RonPerth » Thu May 25, 2006 3:24 pm

Jim, I'm planning a fat-ass style trail marathon in Oct. in Sydenham Park. Right in your neighbourhood. Oct 21, the weekend of the London race. Because a trail run shouldn't cost $300, take 3 days, and involve 300 miles of driving.
Do 1, 2, or 3 20k loops.
The rest of you are all invited too, of course.

Ron

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Postby jgore » Thu May 25, 2006 4:05 pm

Arrgh!!!

Good thing I didn't say I could make it this weekend. Received some clinical samples ... at 4:30 this afternoon. Guess who will be working this weekend. Damned clinicians!

I'll still do the long runs, first thing in the morning.

I really won't be able to commit to any races until I've got all 100 samples I need, which will probably take most of the summer anyway: 30 samples to date. I'm at the mercy of the haematologists, their clinics, and their patients. If samples arrive on Thursday or Friday, I'm stuck, regardless of what's planned for the weekend. If they come just before the July and/or August long weekends, I'll be working all night so I can still do my job at Wolfe Island and the K-Town Tri. So you see why I'm not even thinking of anything until September.

Just so everyone knows, the ones which are on the radar at the moment are the 30K at Haliburton (50K if I'm feeling confident) and the "Run For The Toad 25K", and now the race Ron just mentioned (Thanks for the heads-up on that one.). Because of my situation, I'm not going to make any commitments. It may be none, one, two, or all three, but who knows.

Many thanks for the encouragement, everyone. It is much appreciated ... even though you know I don't race. :wink:

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Postby Doonst » Thu May 25, 2006 6:20 pm

jgore wrote:
Just so everyone knows, the ones which are on the radar at the moment are the 30K at Haliburton (50K if I'm feeling confident) and the "Run For The Toad 25K", and now the race Ron just mentioned (Thanks for the heads-up on that one.). Because of my situation, I'm not going to make any commitments. It may be none, one, two, or all three, but who knows.

Many thanks for the encouragement, everyone. It is much appreciated ... even though you know I don't race. :wink:


Just so you know...

The distances at Haliburton are 25 K, 50 K and up.

Haliburton is considered more technical (tougher) than say Vulture Bait in London. Vulture Bait might be recommended as a better choice for your first 50 K, its the one Robbie-T is thinking of. Then again, Mike Lazenby chose (knowingly??) a "technical" race for his first 50 K last year, Damn Tuff Ruff Bluff. Took him almost 2 hours longer than his recent Toronto Ultra 50.

Here is the list of most Ontario races at that distance:

http://ouser.org/races.htm
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So all you sinners come out
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Postby jgore » Thu May 25, 2006 7:33 pm

Thanks, Sheldon.

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Postby RonPerth » Thu May 25, 2006 9:20 pm

Hey Jim, if you just want to have a look at an ultra race, a few of us will be in Kingston at the Kingston 6 hour race, June 10. Down at the military college. A one klick loop, go-as-you-please, bring a lunch, take a nap if you want, see how far you can go in six hours.
My first time at this; hope I like it. It'll be a long day if I don't.
Ron

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Postby Size5 » Thu May 25, 2006 9:23 pm

RonPerth wrote:Hey Jim, if you just want to have a look at an ultra race, a few of us will be in Kingston at the Kingston 6 hour race, June 10. Down at the military college. A one klick loop, go-as-you-please, bring a lunch, take a nap if you want, see how far you can go in six hours.
My first time at this; hope I like it. It'll be a long day if I don't.
Ron


I'll be interested to hear what you think of a 1km loop Ron.... I always worry my brain will just shut down on that kind of race..... So I'll be interested to hear what you think. On the flip side, you'd always be seeing other runners which would be SUPER cool. This weekend the 50 miler has only 17 racers so I expect to run alone most of the way...

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Postby jgore » Thu May 25, 2006 9:30 pm

I run there frequently. Can't imagine doing a 1K loop for 6 hours. What a bizarre concept. I'll definitely stop by for a while.

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Postby mlazenby » Fri May 26, 2006 7:40 am

Size5 wrote:
RonPerth wrote:Hey Jim, if you just want to have a look at an ultra race, a few of us will be in Kingston at the Kingston 6 hour race, June 10. Down at the military college. A one klick loop, go-as-you-please, bring a lunch, take a nap if you want, see how far you can go in six hours.
My first time at this; hope I like it. It'll be a long day if I don't.
Ron


I'll be interested to hear what you think of a 1km loop Ron.... I always worry my brain will just shut down on that kind of race..... So I'll be interested to hear what you think. On the flip side, you'd always be seeing other runners which would be SUPER cool. This weekend the 50 miler has only 17 racers so I expect to run alone most of the way...

S5


I'm sure the 1k loop won't be too bad.

At least it's better than a 400m track. Check out the Ottawa 24 hour Self-Transcendence:

Start Time: 8 am
Start location: Terry Fox Track, Ottawa, Ontario
Course: 400 metre tartan track

Now there's an excercise in mind over matter.
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Postby Doonst » Fri May 26, 2006 7:48 am

mlazenby wrote:
Size5 wrote:
RonPerth wrote:Hey Jim, if you just want to have a look at an ultra race, a few of us will be in Kingston at the Kingston 6 hour race, June 10. Down at the military college. A one klick loop, go-as-you-please, bring a lunch, take a nap if you want, see how far you can go in six hours.
My first time at this; hope I like it. It'll be a long day if I don't.
Ron


I'll be interested to hear what you think of a 1km loop Ron.... I always worry my brain will just shut down on that kind of race..... So I'll be interested to hear what you think. On the flip side, you'd always be seeing other runners which would be SUPER cool. This weekend the 50 miler has only 17 racers so I expect to run alone most of the way...

S5


I'm sure the 1k loop won't be too bad.

At least it's better than a 400m track. Check out the Ottawa 24 hour Self-Transcendence:

Start Time: 8 am
Start location: Terry Fox Track, Ottawa, Ontario
Course: 400 metre tartan track

Now there's an excercise in mind over matter.


In some ways it seems like the exact opposite of trail races. It has distance in common sure, but the surface and the repetition are a bit different.

How's the ankle Mike?
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One fine day
This blackbird's mute gonna sing again
One fine day

So all you sinners come out
And all you drunkards crawl out
Come into the light of one fine day

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Postby mlazenby » Fri May 26, 2006 8:16 am

Doonst wrote:In some ways it seems like the exact opposite of trail races. It has distance in common sure, but the surface and the repetition are a bit different.

How's the ankle Mike?


It's a whole other zone I think. I'm not sure how I feel about it. TUR was something like that and while I only ran it because it was convenient to my training, I actually ended up rather enjoying it, repetitiveness notwithstanding.

I'd say my ankle is about 90% (or will be by tomorrow). The only thing I'm worried about is that the tensor may cause some friction problems. If worse comes to worse I'll just take it off.

I'm heading out around 2:30 am. What about you? What are your travel plans Sheldon?
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Postby Doonst » Fri May 26, 2006 10:00 am

mlazenby wrote:
Doonst wrote:

How's the ankle Mike?




I'd say my ankle is about 90% (or will be by tomorrow). The only thing I'm worried about is that the tensor may cause some friction problems. If worse comes to worse I'll just take it off.

I'm heading out around 2:30 am. What about you? What are your travel plans Sheldon?


2:30 ouch!! I would stay over in that case. My race doesn't start till 7:30, about an hour there so I'll leave just before six. Guess we won't have much chance to talk again, unless we happen to meet up on the trail going the same way. Good luck.
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This broken wing will fly again
One fine day
This blackbird's mute gonna sing again
One fine day

So all you sinners come out
And all you drunkards crawl out
Come into the light of one fine day

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Postby Lx2run » Fri May 26, 2006 7:22 pm

I've been lurking through this thread for a few days and find it quite interesting. Ever since I started running I have always favoured running on trails and have considered running some of the trail events held across Ontario. It seems there is always something that gets in the way.

After I finished my 1st marathon 2 weeks ago I have been thinking of an ultra as my next objective and reading this thread has given me some more food for thought. So I thank you. I haven’t told any one else about my trail running wish because they may look at me with concern.

From what I have read and the descriptions of the runs hills seem to be a common theme. In Sarnia I run most of my longer run on the abandoned RR trail converted for walking / running / biking. The only issue is that it is terribly flat. There is a trail that opened up a few years ago that has some hills but it short so have to run it repetitively to get anything out of it. If I plan to take this seriously I will be doing some serous hill training runs. I ran into some trouble running the Forest City Mara due to the amount of hills.

Enough rambling…………… may see you out there sometime.
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Postby mlazenby » Sun May 28, 2006 11:41 am

Lx2run wrote:I will be doing some serous hill training runs. I ran into some trouble running the Forest City Mara due to the amount of hills.


Yup. And as I'm sure Dwayne and Krista will back me up, hilly trails make hilly roads seem like a walk in the park.
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