Running Styles

[Cathy]

I was just wondering the other day after looking at some pictures of a recent race and actually being there to watch runners coming into the finish line, how much more efficient are you when you run with your feet closer to the ground? I am not sure what my running style is but I believe that since I used to run short distances in school that I have a tendancy to run with my feet being more elevated (power running for short distances). Sprinting to the finish line is not a good time to be looking but I have been watching peoples running for a while know trying to determine the speed ratio that some people get over what others are doing.

So, are you more efficient/faster when your foot doesn't have that far to go to hit the ground or is it simply a matter of strenght and flexibility that powers us to faster running? And how does the stride length affect things?

[bicycle.boy]

So, are you more efficient/faster when your foot doesn't have that far to go to hit the ground or is it simply a matter of strenght and flexibility that powers us to faster running?

I'm no expert, but I have heard numerous stories of long-distance runners who do the marathon-shuffle. Picking the legs up (apparently) just wastes more energy?

[RayMan]

So, are you more efficient/faster when your foot doesn't have that far to go to hit the ground or is it simply a matter of strenght and flexibility that powers us to faster running?

You have hit the nail on the head! There are different styles out there, but basically lifting your feet higher than necessary, or swinging your arms too much, is going to drain your body's resources much faster than running a smooth, minimalist gait.

It depends on distance, of course; a marathon stride (for me) is much different than the pumping arms and forward lean of a 10k race.

[RonPerth]

In '05 at the Toronto waterfront marathon, I saw the lead group about 4 times, and what I noticed was how high they lift their feet at the back. Totally unlike us slowpokes doing the shuffle. I notice too that RayMan's picture shows his knee bent at about a 90'.
That 'Pose' running form and 'Chi running' suggest moving your feet in a circular motion, and I've grown to kind of like that. Sometimes when I'm tired, I'll mimic other peoples running form and I find it relieves some muscles to run and carry the arms just a little differently.
What I've found makes me tired and sore is to go too slow on purpose, like I did at the 6-hour race this year. I get too heavy footed, taking the spring out of my step, and sore legs follow.
Btw, to get those names, I did a Google for 'running form' and there's lots to look at.
Ron

[rundmc]

You're faster when your feet spend more time off the ground than they do on the ground. Different runners have different strides, forms and the like, but most of that is really extraneous. Worrying about how long your stride is meaningless unless you're overstriding. Your stride, of course, will be different for different distances. My stride is shorter but more efficient when training for a half marathon, longer and more powerful when in great 5k shape.

A shuffler and a kicker whose foot almost comes back to touch the butt can both run equally fast. For example, Danny Kassap, a 2:14 marathoner, is in the latter category. I'm sure he was someone that Ron noticed at the Waterfront Marathon last year. At the same time, I noticed many American runners in the 2:15 range at the Chicago Marathon ran with a shuffle that made it seem like they were running much slower.

Though there is such a thing as good form and it is important, there are many variations in form that are natural and irrelevant to performance.

[Jwolf]

great post, rundmc.

I think the "kick-butt" stride works well because you are effectively propelling yourself forward with the kick back. Those guys look like they're flying. I can't do it, though.

[Marvin Martian]

Here's a good article that pulls together what was mentioned above:
Stride Rate

An interesting point that cadence is the same whether you are going slow or fast (ex. 90 - 95 right foot strikes in 1 minute) but your stride length increases or decreases.

[Cathy]

I have heard of Chi Running before. That sounds interesting as well.

Thanks for all the great input. Its interesting watching others running and basing what you see on their speed etc. I will have to concentrate more on what I am doing and practice a few styles and see what works best. Or maybe just time and stength and flexibility are all that are needed.

[jgore]

I've read that bringing your feet up higher at the end of the stride doesn't necessarily mean a stronger push-off, but it turns the leg into a shorter pendulum, hence, easier to pull it forward. That could make it easier for some to maintain a high cadence. Would it not be a trade-off, requiring more use of the hamstrings and other muscles used in lifting the feet rather than the muscles which pull the leg forward?

I agree with rundmc's comments.

A couple of weeks ago some of the Speedy Ladies and I did a tempo run on a wet field at RMC. Afterward, Lynn and I, who both keep our feet low to the ground, had a bit of mud around the ankles and on our calves. Margarita, who really brings her feet up high behind her, had mud all the way up her back to her shoulders. When they race, Lynn and Margarita have almost identical times.

[QuickChick]

Very interesting thread! I notice that when I bring my feet up I almost automatically go faster. It doesn't feel easier though- it feels like I'm expending more energy. It must be something you can train yourself to do, though.

[scrumhalfgirl]

It must be something you can train yourself to do, though.

You can for sure. When I played rugby, we used to sprint training, with some of the coaches from the Ottawa Lions track club (where such people as Glenroy Gilbert have trained). They really break your stride down into component parts, until you are using the most efficient and effective movements. It's really all about re-training your muscles to move in different patterns.

[RayMan]

I notice too that RayMan's picture shows his knee bent at about a 90'.

Sharp observation, Ron. That photo is from my 10km race when I was running a 4:00 min per km pace.

Photos from my full marathon show a much different form; in my mind I am trying to glide, but it is still a 5:00 min per km pace, so I still kick a little. I lean forward a bit, and swing my arms to keep the pace.

[Cathy]

I also notice your posture in both pictures. You are very upright. When I first started running I said that I felt like I was pounding myself into the ground. Part of that was that fact that I have poor posture and was running hunched over as well as trying to sprint every step. I have been trying to become better posture wise in everything that I do. Certainly I have found that running more upright has helped.

[RayMan]

I also notice your posture in both pictures. You are very upright. When I first started running I said that I felt like I was pounding myself into the ground. Part of that was that fact that I have poor posture and was running hunched over as well as trying to sprint every step. I have been trying to become better posture wise in everything that I do. Certainly I have found that running more upright has helped.

There are people who will say it is too upright, and it's hard to see in the photos but I am leaning forward a little, at the waist. Lean forward too much and gravity takes over, adding stress on the shoulders and seeming to compress the ribcage and thereby lower lung capacity.

[jgore]

I also notice your posture in both pictures. You are very upright. When I first started running I said that I felt like I was pounding myself into the ground. Part of that was that fact that I have poor posture and was running hunched over as well as trying to sprint every step. I have been trying to become better posture wise in everything that I do. Certainly I have found that running more upright has helped.

One thing that really helps is doing exercises for your core - abs, lower back, etc. I makes a big difference, especially when you get tired on longer runs.

[jgore]

I also notice your posture in both pictures. You are very upright. When I first started running I said that I felt like I was pounding myself into the ground. Part of that was that fact that I have poor posture and was running hunched over as well as trying to sprint every step. I have been trying to become better posture wise in everything that I do. Certainly I have found that running more upright has helped.

There are people who will say it is too upright, and it's hard to see in the photos but I am leaning forward a little, at the waist. Lean forward too much and gravity takes over, adding stress on the shoulders and seeming to compress the ribcage and thereby lower lung capacity.

Ray, try leaning from the ankles - keep everything else properly aligned. This is the basis of the ChiRunning/Pose method. One thing they stress is to not lean from the waist.

[Cathy]

My running has been a major slouch. Kinda like a ball running.

[RayMan]

My running has been a major slouch. Kinda like a ball running.

Yep I recognize that style - done it myself too. As JGore suggests, maybe doing some exercises to strengthen your core will help...and I would suggest setting aside one run per week just to focus on form. Run slowly and with grace, letting your muscles and limbs get in tune with the new you!

[Jo-Jo]

Ray is right in not trying to change form all at once. Yes...core strength is important for good running posture.

I was videotaped this summer by my coach and he has asked me to change my foot strike. And he has told me to expect this to take some time. What he often has me do is...for example...on a long run he will ask me to pay particular attention to this new "form" for the first 10 minutes of the run...and the last 10 minutes. What happens in the middle...just happens...if it's the new form great...if not...don't stress. The idea is that over time I will be running the new way hopefully all the time

Good luck!

[La]

I've played around with this a bit myself. I am quite the "shuffler", especially on longer distances and LSD runs. I do try to lift my knees higher from time to time and land on my mid-foot instead of my heel. What I notice is that running like that takes a bit less effort (I don't feel like I have as much resistance from the ground to overcome), but in other ways is harder because I'm using my muscles differently. It definitely takes practice!

[Ken B]

Just adding my $0.02 worth. I have tried numerous methods. I am a heel striker but every time I alter my stride to land on the mid to forefoot areas I get shin splints. I am working on lifting my back foot higher as it leaves the ground, giving me a more circular motion and I feel it is working a bit. I still land on my heel but not at such an angle. Thus reducing the braking effect.

This is a bit harder on my quads but I seem to be more efficient overall.

[Cathy]

Sorry, my computer has been dead for the past two days. Haven't had access to one to reply.

Thanks for all the great input. Will definately have to take more care to pay attention to what and how I am doing things. The first and probably the hardest is to uncurl myself and become more fluid and with that relaxed.

[Iron-North]

I have been trying the shuffle and faster overturn for the last week or so. My running feels much easier and i'm guessing that my pace is the same with less effort. i also find the breathing much easier because i always go 2 in 2 out with my cadence. Since my cadence is faster, my breathing is faster and pretty much effortless!

[barebuns1]

I will always be a shuffler